Jennie Brooks, host of the Unstoppable Together podcast chats with Beverly Garner, a Booz Allen lead associate and a board member of the company's Latin American Network. This Hispanic Heritage Month, listen as they discuss the importance of the collective in Latino and Hispanic cultures and how that can sometimes contrast with the more American trademark of individualism. Beverly discusses what it’s like to exist in both spaces, her experience as a member of the sandwich generation, and her advice for colleagues and leaders of caregivers.
Jennie Brooks:
Welcome to Booz Allen Hamilton's Unstoppable Together Podcast, a series of stories that unite us and empower each of us to change the world. I'm Jennie Brooks with Booz Allen Hamilton, and I'm passionate about diversity, equity, and inclusion. Please join me in conversation with a diverse group of thought leaders to explore what makes them and all of us unstoppable.
Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Unstoppable Together Podcast. I'm your host, Jennie Brooks, and our inspiring guest today is Beverly Garner. Beverly is a Booz Allen lead associate who works for our Navy Marine Corps team. She's a United States Army Reserve officer and she's also a board member of Booz Allen's Latin American Network. Beverly, welcome to the podcast.
Beverly Garner:
Jennie, welcome. Thank you.
Jennie Brooks:
I'm so glad you're here and I look forward to this important conversation. Thanks for joining us, Beverly. We are celebrating Hispanic Heritage Month, and so as part of that, we want to take the opportunity to learn more about Hispanic and Latino cultures.
One of the things that I've watched Booz Allen's Latin American Network discuss over the years is this idea of Hispanic and Latino cultures being more about the collective over the individualistic view. This looks perhaps like putting a lot of focus on your family and your community, and some might say that the individualistic view is perhaps more of an American culture versus a Hispanic or Latino culture. How has that played out in your own life, in your own experiences?
Beverly Garner:
Absolutely. Excellent question. First, to set the stage, I was adopted. So, I am originally from Guatemala. I was born there and came with my brother to the United States when I was about two years old. And then most recently in March of 2022, my biological mom and my sister and my niece all immigrated to the United States.
So, getting to relearn what that culture, that Latino part of my heritage looked like, over the last couple of years, really the big themes come out as being the older sister, and that means not necessarily the matriarch, but somebody that is consistently relied on in the family. Whenever there's a crisis, a lot of my siblings will come running to me like, "Beverly, hey, come help fix this." Or, "Hey, we need support with something else going on." Any issues going on in the family. So, for me, specifically, it's just been that sole support for my family because a lot of times they don't know how to navigate or where to go.
Jennie Brooks:
Do you feel like that experience was reconnecting to culture or was it about learning anew?
Beverly Garner:
Definitely reconnecting, which is really funny in some ways because I thought it was going to be the latter, like you said. But even just simple things like having a meal and my mom and my sister cooked a meal for us and remembering like, oh, yeah, deep inside I knew what this tasted like. This felt like home. Probably similar to people when they're older and like, "Oh, this is the thing that my mom used to make for me, and this is something that feels homey." I felt that with the things that I was getting to eat and getting to read like, oh man, this is a part of me that I get to open up and experience again, that I didn't necessarily know that I was missing.
Jennie Brooks:
Yeah. And when we think about culture, perhaps we think about tradition and to your point, food, roles and responsibilities within the family or community. So, what have you found as you have been restoring or going back to that culture? What's that like?
Beverly Garner:
Well, so for example, my mom, oh my gosh, she's so brave, is legally blind, doesn't speak English. So, coming in to San Diego, trying to navigate even just doctor's appointments and things like that. Having to translate for her, helping her understand the decisions that she's making with her own medical care, and really having to be in those one-on-one conversations. I was definitely not expecting to be thrown into that, but just being willing to do that for her and support her through that.
And then as well, when it comes to my other siblings here in the United States, a lot of times I [inaudible 00:04:31] back to that individualistic, right? Being like, "Oh, I can't handle it. You're going to have to do it, Beverly. I can't handle that. I just can't take on that additional effort to do it or take care of it." So, then a lot of times I'm like, "Okay, well somebody has to in our family, so I'm going to go ahead and take care of it."
Jennie Brooks:
Yeah. Now you're starting to hit on two things that I think a lot of people can relate to, particularly as we are coming through the pandemic, where we saw that caregiver role, perhaps even more pronounced in different ways as people were living, working, schooling, everything from home together. But also, when we talk about the role that family plays in Hispanic and Latino cultures in particular, there's research that looks at what's dubbed the sandwich generation. Right?
So, if people aren't familiar with that, the sandwich generation is when one generation is taking care of older parents or in-laws as well as their younger dependent children. And the research shows that up to maybe 22% of sandwich caregivers are Hispanic or Latino. That's nearly a quarter, which is huge. Right? As a member of this sandwich generation, tell us a little bit more about what that experience has been like for you.
Beverly Garner:
Oh my goodness, yes. Definitely challenging to say the least. My mom's here in San Diego, but then I have my father who's 86 and he's got dementia and he's in Spokane. And then I do have my three children, 2, 6, and 12. Juggling caregiving, childcare responsibilities and then also taking care of older parents and trying to navigate that has been also very challenging. And not even to mention my Army Reserve career along with that.
So, I think the best thing for me when it comes to managing those things has really been a type A person letting go of expectations and saying, "You know what? This is going to be okay. It doesn't have to be perfect. As long as everyone's fed and cared for and..." Not say the bare minimum, but letting go of that, hey, everything has to be perfect all the time. Let's just take care of the really important things, the big things, and make sure that those things are being addressed and taken care of.
Jennie Brooks:
Absolutely. Stay present and in the middle of the mess, right?
Beverly Garner:
Yes.
Jennie Brooks:
That's a lot to have on your plate, emotionally, physically, professionally, spiritually. And when you think about the corporate culture perhaps in America that can reflect and reward more of the individualism that we referenced at the top of our discussion. How have you been able to find that harmony between those two, taking care of yourself, focused on the individual and then the collective nature of the culture?
Beverly Garner:
I think being more intentional with my time and what I'm putting my focus on when it comes to that, and then also being like, I intentionally need to take care of myself too, right? So, we can't pour from an empty cup. So, trying to carve out time, whatever that looks like that week, whatever it can possibly be.
And then also really leveraging my support system. So, I heavily on my husband, on my in-laws, on my friends. Whenever there's a challenge going on, "Hey, look, can you guys cover down on X, Y, and Z so I can focus on something else?" Or even just being like, "Hey, look, I just need to take an hour break. I need to go on a run. I need to decompress." For me, that's just been really crucial just because it is a lot for anybody to take on and handle.
Jennie Brooks:
Yeah, I think that's so important. You've been very brave in sharing some of your story with those listening today. Whether people are colleagues or peers of yours or people in leadership roles, whether in industry or in service elsewhere, what would we want them to know? What would our ask of them be in this conversation?
Beverly Garner:
For the leaders, I would definitely say, have empathy and grace for your team. I think I'm super fortunate that my career manager knows me well enough to be like, "Hey, no, are you really okay?" And I think that comes back to maybe my military training where I compartmentalize everything and I'm like, "No, it's fine. I got it. I got it." Right? "Take care of the mission. I got it." Where there's like, "No, really, are you okay?" And asking and listening and being supportive because it's so important, and that has really allowed me to bring my whole self to work and be like, "Hey, look, this is everything." Right? Instead of thinking that I need to compartmentalize anything or not talk about my Latino culture or me in that instance. It's been really rewarding and having that. So, I just ask that leaders be honest.
And then I think for fellow sandwich generation Latinos or just employees in general, I think the big thing, being able to have those hard and honest conversations with your leadership. And then also not being afraid. I think so many times it's like, "Oh, I don't want to bring them with this challenge because it'll make me look weak or they don't think that I will be able to handle it, then I won't be able to have a bigger challenge." I think just letting that go and just being honest where you are is super important, and I think your leadership will surprise you with what they have to bring,, like solutions or opportunities like, "Hey, look, we can table this till later or work with you." So, just letting go of that fear is super, super helpful.
Jennie Brooks:
Couldn't agree more, and I would add, often in my own experiences when we have a conversation and someone asks for help, what we find is that we are much stronger together, that we see immediate lift. It's not only helpful just to navigate through the circumstance that's right in front of us, but over the short to medium term, we see a lot of added gains from it.
So, I would definitely encourage people who are listening to be comfortable and confident in having the conversation if you are a sandwich generation caregiver, and if you are a colleague or a leader to think about, there's added benefits that come from the conversation, not just the navigating the specific circumstance.
Beverly Garner:
Absolutely.
Jennie Brooks:
It occurs to me that we're talking about being a caregiver and we're focused on quote, unquote "the burden." But in my own experience, I had a moment of clarity throughout the pandemic that felt like, oh, that is a role that I play, and I think there are a lot of silver linings to that role. There's a lot of perseverance and resilience and strength and moments with family, time spent together that otherwise perhaps we wouldn't have if we were in the office or on travel. I think we want to be intentional about reframing the idea of being a caregiver or a member of this sandwich generation. I mean, how beautiful to be able to spend time both with our parents or our grandparents and our children. How do you think about that?
Beverly Garner:
Yes, I definitely agree. I think one thing that I definitely forget about too, and I had a moment where someone just met ... This was being in the Army Reserve in June, and we were doing a drill, and they came up to me and they were like, "It's so great to see you, a Latino officer just like me and somebody I can aspire to." Because in that day-to-day, it's so hard to see that. It's so hard to be like, "Oh, yeah, I can inspire the next generation of people. They have somebody that looks like them doing the same thing." So yeah, I definitely agree.
Jennie Brooks:
You were talking about your mom and she's legally blind, and now she's navigating this country and navigating what is inherently an already complex situation with medical appointments and language. As you observe your mother and you're accompanying your mother through that experience, do you mind sharing with us a little bit about what are you learning from her in this moment?
Beverly Garner:
Oh my goodness, right? So much strength. I can't imagine coming to a new country with a language I don't know, doing it really out of love. She hadn't seen myself or my brother in 35 years. And that was the last thing she kept saying. She's like, "I just want to see my kids one more time in my life." That's all she wanted was to see us again.
So, just being able to move through that, move through the process, and just not give up and have just this profound hope. She's gone through so much in her life, the strength that she has, and the grace and the gratitude has been really inspirational. And getting to share that with my children and getting to show them, "Look, this is what resilience really is."
Jennie Brooks:
And now I'm crying. So, was this the first time you've seen her as well in all those years?
Beverly Garner:
Yes. Yes. Yes. My husband actually found her. It was kind of scary. It was pre-COVID. I think it's like seven years now, but he's like, "No, I found your biological family in Guatemala. I found them." And I was like, "What?" I was so shocked, and I actually got to talk to one of my sisters, because he said he found them, and that they wanted to talk to me immediately, so he couldn't really hold them off any longer, and he's trying to use Google Translate because he doesn't speak Spanish. Trying to communicate with them.
Then COVID happened, so we obviously couldn't go down there to go meet, because I really wanted to go back during that time, and unfortunately it didn't happen. But then she came here. So, I think it all worked out.
Jennie Brooks:
Wow. What a story. Thank you for sharing that with us, Beverly. That's the inspiring story of today, for sure. Beverly, at the end of every podcast, we give our guests some free space to share their final thoughts. What would you like to leave with our audience today thinking about the Hispanic or Latino culture and the sandwich generation?
Beverly Garner:
One thing I hope anybody gets from this conversation is that we can be a lot of things all at once. So, we can be that caregiver, we can be that successful leader at Booz Allen, we can be that great mom, we can be all those things, and we don't necessarily have to shy away from that. So, I hope everyone feels comfortable and confident in moving forward in them and just bringing all themselves to work.
Jennie Brooks:
Thanks, Beverly.
Beverly Garner:
Jennie, thank you for having me.
Jennie Brooks:
Thanks for listening. Visit careers.boozallen.com to learn how you can be unstoppable with Booz Allen. Be the future. Work with us. The world can't wait.